Graham Dewyea: Hello, and welcome to An Hour with an Angel, with Linda Dillon, the channel for the Council of Love and author of The Great Awakening, and Steve Beckow of the 2012 Scenario. Our guest today is Sanat Kumara. I’m Graham Dewyea.
And with that, I’ll pass it on to you, Steve.
Steve Beckow: Thank you, Graham. And welcome, Lord Sanat.
Sanat Kumara: Welcome. Welcome, dear heart and dear friends. I am Sanat Kumara, keeper of Universal Law, planetary logos, and friend and ally of one and of all, and particularly of Venus and of Earth. Welcome to this time of wonderful change, of transition, of opening, of creation and re-creation, and of bringing forth the unfoldment of the Plan with me.
For, as you know, we Kumaras have worked on this for millions and millions of years. And so it is with incredible joy and satisfaction that we work with you at this time. It is not that there has ever been a time that we have doubted this, for doubt is not within our being or lexicon, but it is a very common trait amongst the human race and the old third dimension.
But it is a pleasure and a joy to see this unfoldment, and to see the rising up and the embrace of so many of the higher frequencies.
So, dear friend, what do you wish to discuss this day?
SB: Well, in a minute or so I’d like to discuss with you some fairly profound questions actually. I’d like to have you discuss the purpose of life with us, as a lead-in to a discussion of the role of the Universal Laws in realizing that purpose. But before we begin, can I just confirm for our listeners that you were known to ancient Persians as Ahura Mazda, ancient Hebrews as the Ancient of Days, and ancient Hindus as Subramanya. Is that correct?
SK: Yes, that’s correct.
SB: And you consider Venus in a higher dimension as your home, do you not?
SK: That is correct. That is why I mentioned Venus, and Earth. Yes, I have been known in many ways and by many names and in many traditions. And that is why I referred to the fact that we have been involved with Earth for a very, very long time. But you know, you have an expression upon your planet that you are as young as you feel.
SB: Yes, indeed, Lord.
SK: And so, yes.
SB: Well, if I could just make a point for our listeners, we have a television program called Ancient Aliens which says that when some extraterrestrials came to Earth they were treated as gods. In a certain sense, you could be pointed to as an example of this, could you not? You came to Earth from Venus, and you were looked upon as a god.
SK: Yes. Yes. There are several situations, actually, when those who have arrived from other planets were considered as gods. It was not a sense that we wanted, or that we requested — that is most certainly not the case. But yes, it was because — it was the quality of the higher vibration, it was the quality of being able to teach and co-create, it was the ability to bring forward in many ways what situations or civilizations needed or required, not only to learn, but to experience. So yes.
But let me be very clear. I do not present myself as a god.
SB: No, I understand that, but I’m just trying to illustrate that point about what Ancient Aliens is saying. Did you come to Earth as Quetzalcoatl?
SK: Yes, I had a brief incarnation in that form, assuming that form. Yes, that is correct. There are very few civilizations that I have not been involved with.
SB: And did you give them the Mayan Calendar?
SB: Oh, gee, that is very interesting! Did you also … could you tell us what — and again, this is just a brief, preliminary discussion — what Ezekiel saw when he saw the wheels within wheels? What were they?
SK: You can think of it as the sacred geometry, or the understanding of the energy of One, of how things throughout the universe are all inter-related and connected, and that there is a symmetry and a beauty, and that it is infinite and eternal, and that it goes on and on.
So he was being given a glimpse of the inter-connectedness of all.
SB: Oh, well, that’s very interesting. Thank you for that. Now, you have just told us that you’re the Planetary Logos and keeper of the Universal Law. Hopefully I can ask you, then, to explain to our listeners exactly why the Creator created life-forms in the first instance. What purpose did he — and of course he is not a male — have in mind when he created us?
SK: It was an expression, and we don’t use the word “experiment” because very often there is reference on your planet to the life-form of humans, whether it is upon planet Earth or elsewhere, as simply being an experiment, or an accident. And, of course, neither is true. So let us eliminate that discussion right off the top, as it were.
The idea of creating life-form was to have an expression of form that was considered to be beautiful, an expression of beauty, an expression of potential, not limitation, an expression to have an experience of physicality, of a different expression of form. That was the idea, the creation purpose.
Now, even I do not [pretend] to understand or to know, even in joining all the ins and outs of the infinite One, because as you know there is the quality of the unknowable as well. But let us suggest to you that it was an expression of what you have said – as himself or herself, as the Oneness – to have an expression in many ways, to have form, to have an experience in form, and also to have the expression of what we would call love in a physical reality.
Now, when we say “love” we do not mean simply what you think of so often as the physical reality, but truly the unconditional love, the joining together of hearts. So it is the separation and the unity at the same time. The separation that came to be understood upon your planet is completely gone astray, because the separation was simply an expression of the uniqueness and the diversity and the expression of so many faces, if you want to think of it that way, of how one can conceive.
So that was the original idea.
SB: All right. Thank you, Lord. It’s commonly said that the Formless Transcendental [God in His absolute form] is still and created the Divine Mother, the Holy Spirit, Shakti — although the Mother has said that Shakti is only a small portion of what she is — who then created the Universal Law. Could you discuss that a bit with us? Is that a true statement?
SK: The Divine Mother — and I would never presume to correct the Mother! — but the Divine Mother brings forth ways of creation, of movement, of action, in which we come to know and experience the unknowable, that we can find that place of union between movement and stillness, between all and nothing.
So the Universal Law, as you think of it, as we all think of it, is a way for us to come to know, to understand, to create, and to be closer in alignment, in union, with All That Is. So it was a method or a tool of creation. Michael has spoken to you about Divine Plan, and in a lesser way, though we do not mean this in any way to be demeaning, about rules of engagement.
And in some ways that is how Universal Law has been come to be understood, but it was not that that the Mother was bringing forth when you think of her womb, her movement, her conjoining out of the stillness into the universe, it was a way for us to understand and to be in closer divine union.
So even in the very beginning, the alignment of will was such that there was a will in the Oneness, in the All, in the Source, to be known and to have what creations came forward throughout many universes, to understand, and ways in which to be able to work their way back. So you can think of Universal Law — and I try to use language that is completely understandable, not only to you, my beloved Steve, my beloved Graham, and my beloved Linda, but to all of our listeners; I try to use language that will make common sense to each of you — so it was a guide, a road map, a way in which to know the unknowable.
SB: All right. Well, we’ve talked about the purpose of life; we’ve just introduced the notion of Universal Law. If we could bring a third notion into this I think it would be very helpful, and that’s the notion of what came out of this Divine Plan. What is the Divine Plan? We could probably sense it from what you’ve said so far, but could you be explicit about it, please?
SK: And I am assuming that you are thinking primarily about the Divine Plan as it applies not only to our realm, my realm, but to the realm of Gaia and the human experience as well, because, as you know — or perhaps you do not all know — the Divine Plan is very dynamic. It is not something that is set in stone, although in many ways it is etched throughout the universe. Yes, we know that is a contradiction, but that is the nature….
So let us talk about the plan in terms of what makes sense for Earth and for the human existence, and for what we have been doing together within this universe. So this includes us of the ascended realms, and it also includes your star brothers and sisters and many of the angelic and the archangelic realm. So it is not simply exclusive to the human realm. It also, I might add, includes all the kingdoms and all the realities.
So the Divine Plan, the original plan — let us put it that way — was the creation of this form, this life-form, this expression of One, of All, of Mother/Father/All, to be having the experience of love. But it was further defined that they would have this element because, of course, it was a curiosity on the part of some, and then we would have to go further into what we would refer to as Divine History. But it was considered a desirable aspect to grant and to have the element of free will, of choice, of alignment, so that the experience could be, in each unique expression, self-directed.
Now, when the Gaia volunteered for this undertaking as well, it was understood that this planet would be a place of love. This was the Divine Plan. The Divine Plan was for this humanoid, human collective, and everybody else, to have this experience of love, of joy, of peace, and, yes, of the ability to have free will and choice, to align in whatever way they were wishing to experience that form, and so to be able to travel.
Now, in the beginning, it was what you think of as veils between dimensions, but the sphere within which Gaia was operating was a twelve dimensional sphere, simply because it had so much diversity, choice, wonder, awe, and potential to experience a whole variety of things.
Now the beginning point of that experiment, of that expression, was to have physicality, as you have said, to have form. This was not simply unique to Earth, but the Divine Plan part for Earth was for it to be a place for a physical experience of love, and all of the relevant experiences related to that. But it was not intended, and it was not part of the Divine Plan, that you would be stuck in that form. This became an expression of your free will, of human will — well, I can only say — gone awry.
But the Divine Plan has always been that, regardless of how far you wandered, that you would still recover and learn from the experience — because we do not judge within our realm; it is not considered, oh, this was right, this is wrong; that is not the way that we conceive or operate — but that there would be an awakening, and yes, a great awakening But this has happened in stages, and that there would be a return to love, to awareness, and in that awareness, and in that love, would be the recapturing or the re-embrace, the re-claiming of your divinity, of your ability to be multi-inter-dimensional beings — as is the whole planet, by the way — and that you would have the reconnection not only to the love that is the energy and the substance, the essence, of All, but that you would have the reconnection to the love that you are.
And in that reconnection to the love that you are, that that would create even a grander awakening and opening, and that you would see and come to understand the connection to your fellow human beings, the collective, and, through that, that truly there is no such thing as separation, and through that, that there is only unity. And therefore the expression of what you choose to create in your multi-dimensional self would return and become an expression of what the Divine would create.
So even within what I would refer to as the Divine Plan, there was this flexibility for you to strike. Now because of that wandering, there has been a great deal, more than you probably can conceive of, of assistance that has been brought forward and that was put in place and has been in place for a very, very long time, millions and millions of years, to assist you in that unfoldment and in that evolution, as you — each of you and all of you — evolve back to the One and into the Light, into the Love.
So your question is then, “Lord, are you saying to me that the dissolution of the human race into these false grids, into these false paradigms, was this part of the Universal Plan?” And I say, no, it wasn’t. But the granting and the creation of free will allowed for that flexibility.
Now, you have many — particularly in what you think of as your religious texts — mythologies and stories about the lost soul, or the ones that wander away from the light, and how they are brought back to the light. And the reason that you have these stories is because it is a gentle reminder that has been inspired within the human imagination and mythology, and the history as well, the actual fact, so that you would remember the potential, and the choice, of what you often think of as redemption, of the potential to return back to who you really are.
Now let us suggest to you, it is not a requirement of Source, of One, that you be of the Light to complete what is already eternally and infinitely complete. But it is the Creation, it is the Divine Plan that you will be complete, that you will find and rediscover this wonderful sense and knowing and depth of wholeness, because it is who you are.
That is why we have worked so diligently with her [Gaia?]. And I use the word “work” because it is a word that you understand. But let me be clear, my friend, that the work that my Lady (1) and I, and all of the ascended ones, and all of your star brothers and sisters, all of the archangels, all of the Company of Heaven, all of the Council of Love, the work that we do is not work at all.
Have there been times when we have looked and perhaps shaken our heads, wanting you to come closer, knowing what the eventual unfoldment would be? Of course. Of course. And there have been many ways in which we have taught and guided you, whether you have known it or not, in order for that to happen.
So even when there were times when there were individuals or collectives trapped in the quagmire of illusion, we would still send the inspirations and the reminders and the redirection, so that you would see that lighthouse, so that you would remember that what you were doing was simply a detour and an illusion and not the truth of who you were, individually or collectively.
And what has happened and what is definitely part of this Divine Plan, and the Universal Plan for this area, is that so many of you who have incarnated and returned to Earth…. There is an emphasis on karma a great deal upon your planet, and often you will think, well, I am here to correct or work out some karma. But so many of you simply returned because you knew, in alignment, that you would be the agents and the catalysts of change, that you wished to be in form once again, in this human form, in this expression of divinity, at a time when that remembrance and awakening would occur, because so many of you had witnessed the density of the wandering.
And there had been suffering and pain and experiences of darkness and loss. That is also why so many of you are abhorrent of darkness. It is because you have experienced it on both sides. And it is not to be judged. It is only to be embraced. It is only to be loved.
When you see a child that is playing with fire, and they set themselves mistakenly on fire, do you scold that children? No! You scoop them up. You save them. You tend to them. You heal them. And that, in each of you who are listening, that was your decision, your piece of your plan within the Divine Plan. Is it complex? Yes. But in other ways if you let your mind go of all the ifs, ands, and buts — and we know that you have difficulty with this, because we have traveled that journey — but if you can, then you will see that this expression of Divine Plan, and within the Divine Plan the expression of Universal Law as a way to understand and know Divine Plan is actually very simple.
SB: Lord, perhaps I can intervene at this point. You mentioned Universal Law. You mentioned karma. We usually talk about the Universal Law in pieces: we talk about the law of karma, the law of free will, the law of attraction. But I keep having the sense that it’s a coordinated whole, that the Universal Laws work together to achieve the purpose of life, to achieve the unfoldment of the Divine Plan.
Could you help us, during this part of our discussion, to understand whether this is true? Does the Universal Law operate as a piece, as a coordinated, orchestrated whole? And if so, could you tell us how it does?
SK: Yes. You are completely on track and correct. Universal Law is not fragmented. Universal Law is not this law or that law. Let me be practical. In each of your countries — and I know that there are many listeners who come from different countries, and some are perhaps more lawless than others, but nevertheless — think of your nation that has a collective of laws that you think of as jurisprudence, and it works as a body of law. And those laws — well, actually, some of them have become practically incoherent and contradictory, but when they were formulated – the intention and the purpose behind the law — because many of these were divinely inspired, as you know — it was for the body of the law to work as one, for the body of the law to allow you as a collective to operate in ways that were kind, and ethical, and of integrity and consideration.
Now, these are, yes, granted, a stepped-down version, but still based on what you think of as Universal Law. Now, we need to be very clear, because your listeners sometimes will say, “Well, no that is not so, because what about this law or that law? I am speaking of the intention and the purpose. So let me now revert back to Universal Law.
As I say, the Divine Plan and Universal Law is a comprehensive set, a body of understanding. And it is a body of understanding, so that all the participants — although now we speak of the human beings, because we tell you that we are already in alignment and with understanding of Universal Law — but it was to give you the understanding in the most basic of ways of, “How do things work in my universe? How is it that I am to undertake my life in sacred and meaningful ways, when I am in my human self on a human journey of spirit in form? How do I conduct myself and know that I am in alignment?”
So there are many aspects of Universal Law that you have thought of as a stand-alone laws — and there are dozens of them. But you are very correct to think that there is Universal Law — you can think of it as one entity, as one collective energy. And that energy you can think of, and I have spoken to this channel about this, as the Law of Love, sometimes referred to as the Law of One. But that has become misunderstood very often and misused in some realms upon your planet. So we will talk about Universal Law as the Law of Love.
If you look at the individual laws, what you have come to think of as individual laws, whether it is attraction or give or receive or karma, it is primarily about the balance, and it is achieving balance both within thee, within your sacred being, and not just within one life or one day or one time-frame, but also throughout timelines, even though it is all simultaneous, and in all realms. That is why we talk about above-below, within-without.
That is why we talk about balance so frequently. Because when you are in that place of love, when you are in that collective of understanding, when you have reached the place within your being of simply acknowledging and being love, then that is it. You are in adherence, you are in alignment with the Universal Law.
What you are doing so often in your mental collective human bodies, you are trying to pick the laws apart like a supreme court — or maybe even a circuit court would be a better example. But that is not the spirit, that is not the energy of the law.
So you are often picking at various fragments. It is like trying to break things down when in fact the entire purpose of Universal Law is unification. It is bringing together, not fragmentation. So when you think of Universal Law and yourself, because we want you, we ask you and we guide you to think of Universal Law as a way in which you come to understand how we, how Mother/Father, He/She, All, One, Source, Universe, Divine Plan, how we beckon you back to join with us.
So it is a unifying factor. That is what is called Universal Law. It is encompassing. It is embracing. It is to bring you and us and all together. And the more that you are in alignment — not with the understanding as if you are a legal scholar, let me be clear about this — the more you are in alignment with your multi-dimensional, universal, human, starseed, Earthkeeper self, in alignment with the Law, then the more you are in alignment not only with All but with who you are. And the more you are in alignment with who you are, you are contributing to the absolute ascension of the collective.
Yes, you wondered when I would get to this part, didn’t you?
SB: [laugh] Well …
SK: Because what is ascension other than the reunification? And it is the reunification not only of your sacred self, of your multi-dimensional self — miraculously still in human form, in this beautiful light form that was a creation out of nothingness and All; it was an idea, a light made manifest — and now in that you connect and re-connect not only with your beloved planet and all the kingdoms, but also with your universe and far beyond.
When that happens, you will see much more of me! It is not that I disappear and say, well, I am off to my next assignment now, because I will join you. And then there will be the creation of the new, of the expression that was always part of the Divine Plan, which is the expression of light, of your uniqueness made manifest, and in that uniqueness and manifestation of you, it is the manifestation of All. And so your manifestations, because you are in adherence to the law — and I hope I am clear — it will be in harmony with everybody’s creation and manifestation. It is, it is like the choirs who have tenors and bass and altos and sopranos. It is like the angelic chorus. It is like the orchestras. It is a symphony, but it is a symphony of the universe.
So you are returning, you are returning now to that alignment with the Plan, let us suggest, and the transition — and you are all picking up speed by the way — that transition that you have been fully participating in, and that is true of all of humanity, whether they recognize it, acknowledge it or not — it does not matter, they are a part of it — and that is well, well, well advanced and under way. And what that means, my friend, in very practical terms, I am, as your shepherd, pleased to say that the wandering is over.
Oh, there may be some strays. But most of you, we are very, very proud of you, and we are honored to be part of your undertaking, as you, within our piece of the Divine Plan, which we have not discussed, you are part of our plan as well, you know. You do not tend to think of it that way. But we are also in a unified unfoldment.
SB: Lord, I wonder if we have time before the program ends to discuss one more element of this whole equation. You’ve talked about the purpose of life, you’ve talked about the Divine Plan, you’ve talked about the Universal Laws. There’s one more design feature of life which comes into play here, and I hope I’m correct in saying this, and that is what has been called the longing for liberation, the urge to evolve, the desire to reunite with God, which some people say is built into us and keeps us moving towards God.
Is that correct, what I just said? And if so, could you elaborate a little bit on what’s been called the longing for liberation?
SK: Yes, you are correct. And I would be happy to address this longing, this yearning for freedom, for liberation, and, might I say, for reunion. Now, let us talk about this aspect of the Divine Plan and the birthing of the plan. Because it was, hmm, it was instilled within you by the Divine Mother feminine, and it was the counterbalance — that is the term we would use — it was the counterbalance to free will, to choice; not a cancellation and not an interference. But it was the counterbalance to free will.
So it is in many ways your internal compass. You have compasses that always point true north. Well, your yearning for liberation, your yearning for reunification, your yearning to return home, back to One, to rid yourself of that illusion of separation, of isolation — which is very painful! — was the perfect assurance that at some juncture what you would do is choose to align with the Law, with the Love, with the Mother-Father One, so that you could catapult yourself forward, back home.
So, yes, it is an innate part of you. And this is a very important point that you have raised, because you are at this conjunction where there has been so much discussion, even amongst what you think of as lightworkers or lightholders, about who is permitted, who is right, who is wrong, who is permitted to ascend, who is not.
Now, let me suggest to you — no, let me say very clearly – those discussions are not of love and they are not part of the Divine Plan or the Divine Unfoldment. Every being, regardless of how far you think they have strayed or wandered still has that innate desire, that yearning, for liberation, for reunification. And so, when many of us have spoken to you about this shift, of this change in consciousness, of this shift to the heart of One, of Love, we have been very clear with you that the Divine Plan holds this doorway, this portal, this gateway open for all. It is completely inclusive. It is not exclusive.
And so even in the place of darkness, what, hmm, those on our side — and on yours, by the way, beings like yourselves at In Light Radio — what you are doing is igniting that spark of yearning, of that desire for reunification, of liberation, of freedom. And as it burns brighter and brighter, what happens is it begins to eradicate what you have come to think of as darkness or separation. And so it activates and it burns brightly to bring people to this place of seeking that liberation — in a variety of ways.
And sometimes, yes, that desire has been thwarted or misunderstood, and thought of as a desire for other things that have been of the worldly realm. And that has been an error in understanding. But many are being illuminated by this innate planting of the Mother, and many are saying, “Well, perhaps my choices, my decisions, have not been that which is truly leading me to that place of joy, where I truly feel that I am on my path, that I am on my sacred journey, where not only do I feel that I am loved, but that I can love and that I am loved, and that I am in this wondrous journey with all who are with me, not just my fellow human beings, but my ascended family, my star brothers and families, and more importantly than anything, the Mother/Father/One.”
So I am very glad, my dear friend, that you have brought this point up and that we have had a chance to discuss this, not only as a fragment of discussion, but as part of a unified discussion about Divine Plan, why there is life, what the idea was, and why there is this body called Universal Law. Why is there this body that beckons you to adhere to unification, to what is lost?
So I thank you. But more than this, I thank each of you for actively, pro-actively, even in the trough and the crest of the waves, for seeking that truth and liberation, for actively working, and yes, co-creating with us more than ever. Work the creation formula! That is why we have given it again, very simply, succinctly.
Go with my love.
SB: Thank you, Lord. Thank you for such an integrated discussion of this matter. We’ve been greatly benefitted.
(1) It is not clear whether Sanat is here referring to Gaia, the Divine Mother, or perhaps his twin flame, which many assume to be Lady Master Venus.